If you vote NO you'll be risking taking us to the next elections with this horrible existing document.
Don't do it bro. You'll be taking sides with a dictator (Moi) who has caused Kenyans a lot of suffering.over the years. I don't believe Moi has the best interests of Kenyans in this crusade to shoot down this Proposed Constitution.
Courage
Courage
Sent from my BlackBerry device on the Rogers Wireless Network
From: Jonah Ogaro <jonahogaro@hotmail.com>
Sender: mlalahoi@googlegroups.com
Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2010 04:09:41 +0000
To: mlalahoi mlalahoi<mlalahoi@googlegroups.com>
ReplyTo: mlalahoi@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: NTIMAMA AND K
Nd Elijah Agevi
Time will tell whom was on the right side. I will vote NO even if I remain alone.
Date: Sun, 25 Jul 2010 16:08:49 +0000
From: agevi2007@yahoo.co.uk
Subject: Re: NTIMAMA AND K
To: mlalahoi@googlegroups.com
CC: kibaya@aol.com
Dear Jonah Ogaro,
From: otieno sungu <sunoti@yahoo.com>
To: mlalahoi@googlegroups.com
Cc: kibaya@aol.com
Sent: Fri, 23 July, 2010 0:43:40
Subject: Re: NTIMAMA AND K
From: "kibaya@aol.com" <kibaya@aol.com>
To: mlalahoi@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thu, July 22, 2010 7:13:27 PM
Subject: Re: NTIMAMA AND K
Jonah: You're on the money my friend, you have to talk to the people in villages to get the true pulse. And you have to be a non-player for them to tell you the truth. If you are a player on any side of the debate, they'll tell you what you want to hear so they get your money. The crowds you see wearing T-shirts and in the market places should not deceive anybody; the T-shirt wearers have already been paid and are up for hire by either side, and the majority of the rest of the crowds are anticipating some payment!
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I am sorry for taking everybody backward. Yes was posted on Friday. Today is Sunday in Kenya.
I was intrigued by Jonah assertion that he is not a Ruto follower (may be he is a Moi follower!) but that his NO is based on sound understanding of the draft Constitution. I serious don't get it. Are we using the same draft constitution or does comrade Jonah Ogaro have a different one?
It will be a sad day if comrade Jonah misses the train because of misinformation from his Prof, Dr Rev pastor xyz or from professor of politics or his good students. Jonah we need you on the right side of history. Let's NOT play politics with our lives. No. Constitution making is a solemn and lifetime matter. Let's reason together and let's together GO Green. Ama vipi Jonah?
Regards
Elijah Agevi
Smiling in the Green Corner
From: otieno sungu <sunoti@yahoo.com>
To: mlalahoi@googlegroups.com
Cc: kibaya@aol.com
Sent: Fri, 23 July, 2010 0:43:40
Subject: Re: NTIMAMA AND K
Kibaya, let us raise it to US $ 100? Your take?
Otieno Sungu
From: "kibaya@aol.com" <kibaya@aol.com>
To: mlalahoi@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thu, July 22, 2010 7:13:27 PM
Subject: Re: NTIMAMA AND K
Bw Benji,
Thanks for the civil disagreement. At least you concede Eastern might be at play, but you add if that comes to pass there is someone to blame for it; the VP. But this reminds me of a conversation I had with one of kibaki's advisors(a member of the informal council of elders) soon after the Banana lost the 2005 referendum. I wanted to know how we(I was in 'Yes' then) could mount such a shoddy campaign, no wonder we had lost. The man retorted; " who told you we wanted to win"? Yet the president was as visible as he now appears and all government machinery was as mobilized as they appear now. If Eastern votes 'NO', there will be no Kalonzo to blame for he'll turn around and ask them same qn..
Who mobilizes chiefs and sub-chiefs to campaign for anything? These are the most unpopular folks on the ground and their very presence on any side of an issue is likely to drive wananchi to the opposite side.
Who dispatches wazungus to campaign for what should be a local product, when there are allegations flying around that the product is really wazungus and not a local product? Unless they want to confirm the allegations? Bw Benji, I know you advised that I quit conspiracy theorizing, but the YES side has made so many obvious "mistakes" that I refuse to believe these are not part of some covert scheming.
In 2005 I thought the clamor for new constitution was legit and since over 90% was good, why not secure the good part by passing the draft and then work on the remaining 10%, thereafter? But history and interaction with key 'drivers' have revealed that the constitution as a whole was never the problem in the first place; Moi was! The whole clamor was geared towards scattering some of Moi's presidential powers since 'we' couldn't beat him in the elections. Remember Michuki's confession to this effect? Remember Maina Kamanda's prayer (for which he was arrested), for God to take away Moi since 'we' had lost hope of beating him in the polls? These are Kibaki's right hand men, and I believe he shares in their opinions.
Jonah: You're on the money my friend, you have to talk to the people in villages to get the true pulse. And you have to be a non-player for them to tell you the truth. If you are a player on any side of the debate, they'll tell you what you want to hear so they get your money. The crowds you see wearing T-shirts and in the market places should not deceive anybody; the T-shirt wearers have already been paid and are up for hire by either side, and the majority of the rest of the crowds are anticipating some payment!
Anybody who has recently waged ground-level campaign will tell you this is the voter we're now confronted with in Kenya. Actual campaigning is happening away from the Kinoru stadiums, Tononoka grounds, muliro gardens etc..
But Otieno sungu sitting in far away Juba, or Kuria Wa Mwangi sipping his cold heineken at Charlie Brown in Baltimore, or Dickens Odhiambo enjoying the same in air conditioned Heides club in Wash DC, think the TV crowds translate into votes..No folks!
And I challenge the trio to put their money where their mouths are; $50 on me for each of them if YES wins, to be donated to any on-going charity by YPs.. takers?
Kibaya
-----Original Message-----
From: Jonah Ogaro <jonahogaro@hotmail.com>
To: mlalahoi mlalahoi <mlalahoi@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Jul 22, 2010 4:04 am
Subject: RE: NTIMAMA AND K
From: Jonah Ogaro <jonahogaro@hotmail.com>
To: mlalahoi mlalahoi <mlalahoi@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Jul 22, 2010 4:04 am
Subject: RE: NTIMAMA AND K
Nd Benji
The YES will win if only they customize the template from Comrade Mugabe i.e. intimidation, bribery, killings, use of satte machinery, civil servants, rigging etc. Otherwise on fair playing field they cannot win.
I'm not a follower of Ruto or anyone. My NO is based on my understanding of the draft. Just to remind you that we have also people in the YES side who are not clean. As I have mentioned before, most of those people on the YES side happily worked with Moi in the KANU government. Now that they are on the YES side, they are 'reformers'. Bure kabisa.
Date: Thu, 22 Jul 2010 09:15:47 +0100
From: me_benji@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: NTIMAMA AND K
To: postmaster
CC: kibaya@aol.com; jonahogaro@hotmail.com
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The YES will win if only they customize the template from Comrade Mugabe i.e. intimidation, bribery, killings, use of satte machinery, civil servants, rigging etc. Otherwise on fair playing field they cannot win.
I'm not a follower of Ruto or anyone. My NO is based on my understanding of the draft. Just to remind you that we have also people in the YES side who are not clean. As I have mentioned before, most of those people on the YES side happily worked with Moi in the KANU government. Now that they are on the YES side, they are 'reformers'. Bure kabisa.
Date: Thu, 22 Jul 2010 09:15:47 +0100
From: me_benji@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: NTIMAMA AND K
To: postmaster
CC: kibaya@aol.com; jonahogaro@hotmail.com
| Ogaro and Kibaya, I've got news for you. YES side will win, my only doubts being esp Eastern province and if that goes awry the kamba chief (VP) will have to take responsibility for that. The NO side has poked holes in everything and exploited fear and uncertainty which is natural when one is unsure. But as time passes and Kenyans think about it more and more, there is everything to gain from passing the document and moving the country forward. Ruto has so many issues coming up, and complex ones. We aren't worried about him, he aint no hero. Credit to Moi for his consistency, has a great vision to shackle Kenya to KANU-ism and politics of 1983. Cheers! p.s Flying a recupertating 65 year old around the country is not the same as him sitting at home receiving delegations. So stop with the conspiracy theories. the principals together on this issue, equals a win. --- On Wed, 7/21/10, kibaya@aol.com <kibaya@aol.com> wrote:
|
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